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Now Trumpedo is threatening to invade Nigeria, "and may very well go into that now disgraced country, 'guns-a-blazing,' to completely wipe out the Islamic Terrorists..."

Serious question: At what point do republicans and the media admit that this guy is insane?

Serious question: At what point do republicans and the media admit that this guy is insane?

I think when he actually does go into a country, "guns-a-blazing."

Trump frequently makes threats. He seems to have no compunction about whether or not he will stand behind the threats he makes - for example, he has threatened Hamas several times, but no one seriously believes there's any likelihood that Trump will send U.S. troops into Gaza.

Trump believes - probably foolishly, perhaps even naively - that such threats are useful and effective tools of foreign policy, even though they are mostly empty threats. They are not always completely empty. In situations where the U.S. can use military force without any possibility of U.S. casualties (like blowing up fishing vessels from a distance), and against countries that cannot plausibly retaliate or escalate (like Venezuela) those threats are more credible - but only to the extent of action that cannot result in U.S. casualties. Since there is only a limited set of circumstances where such threats are credible, most of his threats are dismissed as empty.

Since Trump shows no signs of believing there are any long-term costs to U.S. credibility from making empty threats, his practice of frequently making them is not "insane." It's just wrongheaded and stupid. If he were to actually launch an invasion of Venezuela or Nigeria, that might generate more of a reaction from Republicans and the media.

(like blowing up fishing vessels from a distance),

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Those are not fishing vessels.

And, his excuse for this one:

Trump threatens Nigeria with military action

“If the Nigerian Government continues to allow the killing of Christians, the U.S.A. will immediately stop all aid and assistance to Nigeria, and may very well go into that now disgraced country, ‘guns-a-blazing,’ to completely wipe out the Islamic Terrorists who are committing these horrible atrocities,” the president wrote.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/trump-threate...

Seriously? How many dozens of Christians are killed in Shinyland, every day?

But think, for a moment. What do Nigeria and Venezuela have in common? Oil. Take their oil production off line with military action, supply tightens, the price goes up, and his nibs' paymasters in big oil make more profit. Recall, "Rant #1", over 20 years ago, said that the invasion of Iraq was for the same purpose: take Iraqi production off-line, to juice western oil company profits.

Steve

Since Trump shows no signs of believing there are any long-term costs to U.S. credibility from making empty threats, his practice of frequently making them is not "insane." It's just wrongheaded and stupid. If he were to actually launch an invasion of Venezuela or Nigeria, that might generate more of a reaction from Republicans and the media.

Are Christians having a fun time in Nigeria? Is this a new thing?

Are Christians having a fun time in Nigeria? Is this a new thing?

Is it the job of the US to protect Christians, everywhere in the world, or only in countries with oil, so the US oil companies and regime can make lots and lots of lovely money?

Steve

Think, what do Venezuela and Nigeria have in common?

No, albaby1, when Trump says things especially on social media about possible course of action he might try to take, they are not at all "empty threats."

They are more correctly viewed as "trial balloons." He then waits for the feedback and triangulates and adjusts. Of course he gets feedback from many other places such as his advisors, the military, etc.

He takes the temperature of public opinion, and elite opinion, and media opinion, directly and in a clearly attributable way.

This is a much more honest and transparent approach than using they typical "anonymous sources" planting things in friendly media outlets.

Those are not fishing vessels.

They're not aircraft carriers.

I'm not labeling them as such based on what they're being used for, but the physical nature of the vessels. These are for the most part fishing vessels (or other transportation craft) that are being used for smuggling, but physically have no characteristics that pose a responsive threat to a military force seeking to destroy them with missiles or long guns.

Pathological narcissim + megalomania + dementia = Donald Trump.

What could possibly go wrong?

And the MAGA crowd cheers him on.

CULT!

Is it the job of the US to protect Christians, everywhere in the world,

Then why did the Obama administration make this a thing? Don’t you want to “Bring back our girls”?

Then why did the Obama administration make this a thing? Don’t you want to “Bring back our girls”?

The Obama administration did amplify the voices of Nigerian mothers who were saying this.

But as far as I know, he never threatened to go in with “guns blazing”.

Instead , acknowledging that Boko Haram and other Al Qaeda allied groups were increasing activity in Africa, Obama strengthened AFRICOM, the joint command structure that had already been put in place by George W. Bush.

But as far as I know, he never threatened to go in with “guns blazing”.

Instead , acknowledging that Boko Haram and other Al Qaeda allied groups were increasing activity in Africa, Obama strengthened AFRICOM, the joint command structure that had already been put in place by George W. Bush.

Okay. So we have a command in Africa and have had Special Forces there in the past:

https://www.armytimes.com/news/your-army/2018/11/0...

Don’t you want to “Bring back our girls”?

Are you talking about that, iirc, 200-300 school girls that were kidnapped?

Interesting that the Wiki article about that case says that incident was part of a much broader campaign against schools, what the Islamic boogymen viewed as the equivalent of "woke indoctrination".

Steve

Okay. So we have a command in Africa and have had Special Forces there in the past:

Yeah- I thought this might be where you were going.

From your linked article:

<> The Times reported that a letter of reprimand given to Perozeni cited the team’s insufficient training and a lack of mission rehearsals. The two senior officers who approved the mission and oversaw the ill-fated operation were not reprimanded, according to the Times, while Hicks was reprimanded for not having appropriate oversight of the officers below him.
A 6,300-page investigation detailed by the Pentagon in May said that the mistakes leading up to the ambush were widespread. An unclassified eight-page summary was released for public viewing.

When something goes wrong, and with special operations, something almost always goes wrong, the Pentagon will inevitably generate reams of mind numbing reports in order to assess blame.

Some of that is a good thing. Looking at the example above, the report identifies “insufficient training and a lack of mission rehearsals”. That’s good information to have in order to prepare for future missions.

It’s a shame that in the military- someone always has to take the fall when something goes wrong. But that’s the nature of the beast and relentless after-action analysis IS (or at least has been) a major strength of our military.

But hierarchical organizations being what they are, those who are identified as being responsible for failure are not always those responsible for the greatest failures.

Are Christians having a fun time in Nigeria? Is this a new thing?

Maybe, while Lord Trump is in Christian protection mode, he'll send the Marines into Israel, to protect Christians from the IDF and Jewish settlers?

A wave of Israeli settler attacks reaches a Christian village in the West Bank

While the world's focus is on the war in Gaza, violence has surged in another Palestinian territory, the Israeli-occupied West Bank. A new wave of Israeli settler attacks has reached a Christian village there, and it has drawn the attention of U.S. ambassador to Israel Mike Huckabee, who is actually a vocal supporter of Israeli settlers. NPR's Daniel Estrin reports from the West Bank.

https://www.npr.org/2025/07/24/nx-s1-5476663/a-wav...

Or is it OK for Israelis to terrorize Christians? I'm confused.

Steve

I'm not labeling them as such based on what they're being used for, but the physical nature of the vessels. These are for the most part fishing vessels (or other transportation craft) that are being used for smuggling, but physically have no characteristics that pose a responsive threat to a military force seeking to destroy them with missiles or long guns.

Exactly so. One thing we never found on pangas was weapons or expended brass. I gotta think the pangeros knew that if they were spotted landing through the surf they'd be sitting ducks out in the open. No way they'd survive a firefight with LEOs. It's not like they cold swim for it. There have been some high speed chases, but never shooting.

..as to Trump's claim that he's closed the border completely.... even with our infrared scanners on the bluffs, some are getting through.


https://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/coast-guard...

https://fox5sandiego.com/news/local-news/us-coast-...

Or is it OK for Israelis to terrorize Christians? I'm confused.


Sorry Steve, but brown Palestinians cannot be Christians.

(Notwithstanding the fact that the majority of Christians on this globe now live in the developing world)

Sorry Steve, but brown Palestinians cannot be Christians.

Ignoring for the moment that Jesus would have been brown, not the blonde, blue eyed, matinee idol we have been presented with, who is going to organize the committee that decides who, among the practicing Christians in the world, are "real Christians" and who are not? Sticks in my mind former Pope Benedict, who proclaimed that only the Catholic church was a real church, passed recently. So, who gets the job?

Steve

Those are not fishing vessels.

Fun Fact: According to the Coast Guard’s own records, 27% of the boats they have intercepted for being suspected drug ships are found to contain no drugs at all. (*Statistic quoted by Rand Paul in Congress)

Are you comfortable knowing that more than a quarter of potential targets of this sort of extra-judicial aerial bombardment have nothing to do with the issue?

So you're saying 73% of the boats are found to have drugs on them, and the other 23% managed to toss the drugs overboard before getting caught, or perhaps hadn't picked up their drug cargo yet, or perhaps had off loaded their drug cargos already.

Thanks for providing solid factual support for Trump's policy.

So you're saying 73% of the boats are found to have drugs on them, and the other 23% managed to toss the drugs overboard before getting caught, or perhaps hadn't picked up their drug cargo yet, or perhaps had off loaded their drug cargos already.

With this sort of logic I can only assume you’re also in favor of executing people suspected of being murderers, even if they have disposed of the weapon, never fired the weapon, or indeed never had a weapon to being with.

Nice legal system you got there.

their drug cargo yet, or perhaps had off loaded their drug cargos already.

Highly likely they didn't have any drugs or were not picking up drugs. In the PI, there are plenty of outrigger stabilized fishing boats that have no masts or commercial fishing rigs like in US ports, but some do, and many have only one stabilizer. Here are some of the better looking ones:

https://www.alibaba.com/showroom/commercial-fishin...

The odds tell us the more boats we blow up, the more likely we are to have killed innocents. I know you don't care, but this is not likely to have any effect on the fentanyl or carfentanil made in Mexico. India, etc., can pick up any slack if the Chinese crack down on precursor chemicals. So do you advocate a policy of blowing up Mexican boats too?

Venezuela has less drugs coming from it than Colombia or Mexico, though transhipments are high for Colombian Cocaine through Venezuela. Mexico is a major source for fentany, meth, heroin, and cannabis and we're doing nothing there. So the drugs are poartial cover for getting rid of Maduro, but if we do get Maduro out, what replaces him?

Here are some of the better looking ones:

https://www.alibaba.com/showroom/commercial-fishin...

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Dude, most of those were pleasure boats or for recreational fishing, Yeah there were a few trawlers among the pictures. But most were small single engine, what we call bay boats, not suitable for off shore. I looked through five pages of pictures and did not see one with three engines like your standard Venezuelan "fisherman". Do you realize just one 300+Hp outboard costs $40-50K. I doubt the poor Venezuelan fisherman struggling to feed his family spends $150K on engines before he even buys the boat.

Dude, most of those were pleasure boats or for recreational fishing, Yeah there were a few trawlers among the pictures. But most were small single engine, what we call bay boats, not suitable for off shore. I looked through five pages of pictures and did not see one with three engines like your standard Venezuelan "fisherman". Do you realize just one 300+Hp outboard costs $40-50K. I doubt the poor Venezuelan fisherman struggling to feed his family spends $150K on engines before he even buys the boat.



Hey, I still want to hear how the average fisherman goes out and fishes with the small submarine. Do they submerge and drag a net around?

You seemed to be confused about the difference between an extra-territorial military operation and domestic law enforcement/criminal justice procedures.

Dude, most of those were pleasure boats or for recreational fishing, Yeah there were a few trawlers among the pictures. But most were small single engine, what we call bay boats, not suitable for off shore. I looked through five pages of pictures and did not see one with three engines like your standard Venezuelan "fisherman". Do you realize just one 300+Hp outboard costs $40-50K. I doubt the poor Venezuelan fisherman struggling to feed his family spends $150K on engines before he even buys the boat.

I realize you say that, but those are the good looking ones. And it appears you would absolutely not believe what people will put to sea in. They will go out to sea in dayboats, but mostly old style boats plus. They might even have a mast for a sail, but rarely use it, though the culture may have been seafaring. The long off shore fishers use both sails and engines to get over where the money fish are. They are in no sense speed boats - they chug along assisted by sails. 25% of them have TB.

The big pangas that really move are specialists. Takes money to run that.

They are in no sense speed boats - they chug along assisted by sails. 25% of them have TB. - Lambo

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So you agree with me, the boats that Trump is eliminating are not like the ones shown in your link. So what was the point of linking it?

I am simply saying the three or four engine speed boats seen in the Trump videos are not fishing vessels, especially the submarine.

I am simply saying the three or four engine speed boats seen in the Trump videos are not fishing vessels, especially the submarine.

I've seen those boats with the 4 engines. The ones I saw were used for sport fishing mostly, but we had high speed craft that moved between the mainland and islands regularly in CA, and they'd go out past the islands, some of them to fish. Some of the boats out there were equipped with a lot of electronics. They would go out and spot schools of squid, etc., and how far down they were. Specialized.

And what you have are small chains of islands in the Caribe, so they'd be moving between islands and stand out. Anyone who's out there will see the boat unless you do it at night with no lights. There's a constant stream of boats.

And as Sano told us, some of the boats had more people on them - travelers being transported - certainly not a crime worthy of the death penalty. Bombing boats obviously has nothing to do with fentanyl. Cocaine overdoses don't happen that often. If you're blowing up boats, sooner or later you are going to blow up innocents.

am simply saying the three or four engine speed boats seen in the Trump videos are not fishing vessels,

Very fast 3 and 4 engine speedboats are not your average saltwater fishing boat but there are a very large number of them used for all sorts of activities. There are a surprising number of $250K + versions. Just do a quick search on boattreder.com using > $50000, 3 engines and you will come up with hundreds of them for sale. Some even get over a mile per gallon of gas at full speed.
https://www.boattrader.com/boats/type-power/engine...

Something I’m honestly curious about… Let’s assume for the moment that the strikes on these boats have all been on ‘bad guys’ aka drug runners. What is the advantage to the Administration or its congressional allies of being so unforthcoming with evidence?

Very fast 3 and 4 engine speedboats are not your average saltwater fishing boat but there are a very large number of them used for all sorts of activities. There are a surprising number of $250K + versions. Just do a quick search on boattreder.com using > $50000, 3 engines and you will come up with hundreds of them for sale. Some even get over a mile per gallon of gas at full speed


Mike is acting as if 4 engine boats were designed for drug running and all other purposes are negligible. It's likely the other way around.

snip Applications for speed

Transport: High-speed pangas are used for ferrying passengers or goods between islands or to remote coastal areas, as noted by Panga Sports.
Tourism: The speed and efficiency make them ideal for activities like whale watching, snorkeling tours, and island hopping, allowing operators to cover more ground in less time.
Fishing: A fast panga allows anglers to quickly reach fishing spots or cover more territory when trolling or casting lures, as explained by Xpress Boats. snip

ME: What I hope doesn't happen is the intelligence contacts on the boats get bribed and they start allowing some boats to get bombed ( with fake dope), and they designate a few tourist/sportfisher boats to be blown up. As Soon as you blow up a few civilian boats it will get ugly and we'll have a terrible reputation in Latin America. The CIA is fallible, but does fairly well over all. Curve ball, anyone? So let's not pretend it isn't risky, that we can't already have blown up innocents, and that plata o plomo, silver or lead, is very real.

And as Sano told us, some of the boats had more people on them - travelers being transported - certainly not a crime worthy of the death penalty.

The fiberglass subs they build in the mangroves are semi-submersible; not true subs. They're built to move coke. I've seen some interior photos; miserable conditions.

Most of the pangas we got, the ones still streaming north, mostly with migrants, were single OBs.... like the one I owned in Mex with 4 fishing buddies. 26'/single suzuki/tiller. The commercial guys perfected launching and landing through some pretty good sized surf.

If they could turn and burn after offloading people + cargo, they did. If turn and burn south wasn't possible (not enough fuel, sank in sand too quick) they captain/crew would leave with the land team.

The really big pangas, >26' with >1 motor planned their landings for beaches or coves that previously were conducive to spinning the boat to launch, like sttep cobbles of a lee. BUT some got nailed by a wave anyhow and ended up too high and dry for the crew to spin. 4 motors cause a transom to sink in wet sand fast. It takes a team to get them off remote beaches.... which is where we came in.

Some of the boats being targeted are, no doubt, loaded with coke. Some with people, some with both. Whether there are drugs on board or not, indiscriminately killing traffickers and innocents is killing innocents.

What is the advantage to the Administration or its congressional allies of being so unforthcoming with evidence?

1. It’s difficult to produce verifiable evidence when you don’t have any.

2. It’s to a dictator’s advantage to act unilaterally, demonstrating that his power is without constraints.

Constitutional checks and balances? What Constitutional checks and balances?


(Concern about such things is simply a bad case of Trump Derangement Syndrome)

Tut tut.

I see what you mean:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/23/colo...

Cadet Bonespurs, the lying coward, is ordering the murder of people in pangas to instigate a fight with Maduro.
End of story.


The President has justified the strikes as a matter of national self-defense, claiming, without evidence, that drugs from the region are responsible for three hundred thousand deaths in the U.S. last year. “To every terrorist thug smuggling poisonous drugs into the United States of America, please be warned that we will blow you out of existence,” Trump said at the United Nations last month. “Each boat that we sink carries drugs that would kill more than twenty-five thousand Americans.” There were about eighty thousand drug-overdose deaths in the U.S. last year. Fentanyl, which was responsible for the overwhelming majority of them, doesn’t come from Venezuela, and the Coast Guard has no record of seizing it in the Caribbean.

I'm ashamed that our US Navy has agreed to follow illegal orders in violation of international laws.

Using Trump's reasoning, he could order strikes on trucks carrying heroin in the the Golden Triangle and freighters carrying fentanyl chemicals from Asia.

He's targetting one of the lesser damaging of the 'recreational' drugs (compared to opiates and fentanyl) for purely political purposes.

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