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We have friends who live on Treasure Island, a barrier island suburb of Tampa. Two days ago, they posted a photo of cleaning up the mess after the hurricane that ripped through the area several days ago.

“Livin’ the dream” they ironically captioned the photo

Now cometh Milton, just upgraded to Cat 5. w/ 160 mph sustained winds. Expected to weaken before landfall….small consolation.

First hurricane in recorded history to approach Tampa directly from the west. Lots of storm surge with this one, even if it is downgraded before it hits.

If I had a choice, I would not live in a coastal area with hurricanes. So pretty much all the FL coast is out, as well as TX and LA (and MS and AL). I might be willing to live inland. Maybe. No place is perfectly safe, of course. But if you live in Miami Beach or a barrier island off Tampa, seems like you're just rolling the dice and hoping it comes up box cars, and any other roll you lose.

If I had a choice, I would not live in a coastal area with hurricanes. So pretty much all the FL coast is out, as well as TX and LA (and MS and AL). I might be willing to live inland. Maybe. No place is perfectly safe, of course. But if you live in Miami Beach or a barrier island off Tampa, seems like you're just rolling the dice and hoping it comes up box cars, and any other roll you lose.

Pretty much!

It wasn’t the main reason, but it was certainly one of the reasons I moved from Galveston in 2003.

When I moved, my house sat 10 feet 7 inches above sea level. Now it’s 9 feet 11 inches above sea level.

I'm not sure I would go for Michigan again. I was small, but I do remember snow that stung my face. It wasn't the light, fluffy stuff drifting gently downward. It hurt. Yeah, I was only 5. It was beyond cold, too. I went to high school in Denver (so not allergic to snow), but Kingston was a whole 'nuther thing.

First hurricane in recorded history to approach Tampa directly from the west. Lots of storm surge with this one, even if it is downgraded before it hits.

Worth noting how much can depend on a few miles of shift in where landfall hits.

Right now, Tampa Bay is kind of in the center of the forecast track. If the center hits 10-20 miles north of Tampa Bay, it's catastrophic - all that wind will push massive amounts of storm surge into the bay.

But if it moves 10-20 miles south of Tampa Bay, the wind is coming from the other direction (hurricanes are always counterclockwise in the northern hemisphere). Now, all the wind is pushing water out of Tampa Bay. Depending on the vagaries of the wind patterns, the water level might even fall.

The margin of error on our forecast track this far out is well over a hundred miles. So TB is on a knife-edge between a bad storm and a catastrophic storm.

I'm not sure I would go for Michigan again. I was small, but I do remember snow that stung my face. It wasn't the light, fluffy stuff drifting gently downward. It hurt. Yeah, I was only 5. It was beyond cold, too. I went to high school in Denver (so not allergic to snow), but Kingston was a whole 'nuther thing.

My wife, who moved to Michigan ten years before I did, swears that the winters here were colder back then (1993) than they are now. Dunno. Anecdotal evidence and all that- but it does seem the temps here don’t get down to zero as much as they used to, and those storms that drive ice crystals in your face seem rarer than wheen I arrived in late 2003.

The snows still can get deep up north where Mike used to snowmobile, but not quite as often and for not quite as long.

At our cabin up north, a few dirty snow drifts usually remained in the deep woods till the second week of May or so. Now they are gone by the end of April, or at least such has been the case for the last three years. Could be an anomaly, but the contrast between now and just a few years ago is pretty stark.

No place is perfectly safe, of course. - 1pg

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No sh*t. Who would think you would need flood insurance in the mountains of North Carolina. There are maybe a hundred thousand people whose homes were erased by the hurricane, and their insurance doesn't cover flooding. These people literally have nothing!

Winter is coming in two or three months. I hope our infallible FEMA experts are busy at work constructing temporary villages where these victims can live (sort of) for a year or two.

bighairymike: I hope our infallible FEMA experts are busy at work constructing temporary villages where these victims can live (sort of) for a year or two.

Please keep up. Speaker Moses Johnson said no more money for FEMA until the House receives an accurate estimate and detailed cost analysis for relief spending.

Or until republican lies hurt the republican party and DonOLD Trump's re-election chances more than it hurts the democrats and average Americans in the devastated states.

Or until his lord and savior Orange Jesus says it's okay.

To my knowledge, flood insurance is always a separate coverage. Usually backed by the US government. I know I don't have flood coverage as part of my policy, and it's not available as a rider. I would have to buy a completely separate policy from someone who offers one.

I'm not sure that FEMA builds villages, but maybe? With a competent head, and some funding, the response should be as good as is possible.

Please keep up. Speaker Moses Johnson said no more money for FEMA until the House receives an accurate estimate and detailed cost analysis for relief spending.

Or until republican lies hurt the republican party and DonOLD Trump's re-election chances more than it hurts the democrats and average Americans in the devastated states.

Or until his lord and savior Orange Jesus says it's okay. - sano

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Wow. No empathy or even acknowledgment expressed at all for these helpless victims. And six rec's too.

Just launch into the usual Trump tirade and Republicans this and that, and call it good.

Nothing new or useful there. Not unexpected.

When I moved, my house sat 10 feet 7 inches above sea level. Now it’s 9 feet 11 inches above sea level.

I live in Central Florida 150 feet above sea level, with a gentle slop rising toward the west coast from me. Milton is headed for it, so we'll see how it fares, but I'm headed to Maine to see a friend I haven't seen since we were paratroopers in our youth.

No sh*t. Who would think you would need flood insurance in the mountains of North Carolina. There are maybe a hundred thousand people whose homes were erased by the hurricane, and their insurance doesn't cover flooding. These people literally have nothing!

I'm sorry Mike, but there are flood maps and frequency of floods for all of the US to my knowledge. N Carolina had a catastrophic flood 100 years ago. Asheville was wiped out back then.

The city where I live has a small 10 house area that is designated as a flood zone. Now you would think that being in Florida everyone would carry it. They don't. There's places on the internet that will rate your properties chances. I've used them all. Minimal chance on flooding , high on wind damage. It's not cheap, that's the reason people don't get it.

>>No sh*t. Who would think you would need flood insurance in the mountains of North Carolina. There are maybe a hundred thousand people whose homes were erased by the hurricane, and their insurance doesn't cover flooding. These people literally have nothing!<<

I'm sorry Mike, but there are flood maps and frequency of floods for all of the US to my knowledge. N Carolina had a catastrophic flood 100 years ago. Asheville was wiped out back then. - Lambo

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I did a little non scientific research, and you are right about Asheville, and although I did not check, I think it is reasonable that North Carolina has a few 100 year floods almost every year somewhere within the state.

Beyond that I took an article from USA today that listed small towns flooded by
Helene, and here are the search results when asked, "has <City Name>, N.C ever flooded before Helene?"

Boone - Sorry, no relevant information was found in our search.

Banner Elk - Sorry, no...

Black Mountain - Sorry, no...

Cherokee - Yes, Cherokee, NC has experienced flooding before Hurricane Helene. The area has a history of flooding, with residents becoming accustomed to significant flood events over the years.

Micaville - Sorry, no...

Mills River - Sorry, no...

Swannanoa - Sorry, no...

Henderson - Sorry, no...

Marshall - Sorry, no...

Mars Hill - Sorry, no...

Waynesville - Sorry, no...

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So from this list, the hapless uninsured residents around Cherokee can suck it.

However, for the rest of these towns, and no doubt many more, my assertion stands. Their homes are rubble piles if they can be found at all, these victims have nothing and need our help. So does Cherokee too, just making a point.

This is so massive, I frankly can't envision how this plays out,. Winter is coming and many of these people have no shelter. I did a little checking on FEMA housing and here are examples of the type of help available

"Sep 10, 2024. You must have a FEMA application number and approval from FEMA to participate in the Transitional Sheltering Assistance (TSA) program.Use the hotel locator to find a participating hotel.. If you have questions about TSA or need help locating a hotel, you may also call the FEMA Helpline."

and this

Direct Temporary Housing Assistance - FEMA.gov
Oct 26, 2022FEMA may lease existing, ready-to-occupy residential properties for use as temporary housing. Eligible property types may include vacation rentals, corporate apartments, second homes, single-family homes, cooperatives, condominiums, townhouses, and other readily fabricated dwellings.

All these programs place victims into existing housing in one form or another. But what if the supply is far short of the demand? There needs to be massive shelter construction going on somewhere, something akin to all the temporary migrant shelters that NYC put up all around the city when they ran out $300/night hotel rooms.

OK, you need to check flooding maps, and there's places to assess flood risks. I told you about the small area where 10 houses are designated a flood zone in my area. But in the ranking scales anything above a 1 or 2 out of 10 should consider flood insurance. My residence is 1 out of 10. If your house is by a lake or a river, consider flood insurance. People don't buy the insurance because it's expensive.

Guess what the reason is that only gov insurance covers floods? People build houses in flood plains - which we all know about. But there are places where you can plug in your address and get risk assessments. Per memory I'm Flood 1, Wildfire 9, Wind 9 out of 10. You'll find places that tell you nearly everywhere is a flood zone, but that's overdoing it.

Now I didn't get flood insurance. I'm not likely to be hit by a storm surge at 150 feet above sea level, and I'm far enough away from the lake and upslope enough I'm very unlikely to be flooded that way. So when I decided against flood insurance I'd done some research. For instance, the ground above me can become saturated so there's a possibility a chunk of ground can become loose and slide down the gentle slope.

People don't buy flood insurance because it's separate and expensive. Why do you think Insurance companies don't have flood insurance in their coverage?

People don't buy flood insurance because it's separate and expensive. Why do you think Insurance companies don't have flood insurance in their coverage? - Lapsody

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To be clear, I am not complaining that standard home insurance does not include flood insurance. If it was included, the cost of HO insurance would sky rocket for everybody and most people don't need it. And yes I am savvy enough to konw about flood plains, flood maps and how to use the internet.

Getting back to the point I as making, there is a huge and looming problem with flood victims, especially in remote areas, will be facing winter in a few months and they have no shelter. The FEMA programs that I can find anyway all require and victim to file paperwork, then go find a hotel, and FEMA will pay for it for a while. Or FEMA may lease some available vacation homes, etc and assign one to you for up to 18 months as I recall.

IMHO, these FEMA programs are well intentioned and effective to some degree. But their process is significantly inadequate to meet the needs of the present situation. FEMA needs to provide housing, not an application process for people with no resources to navigate. Treat these flood victims as if they were migrants, and by that the migrants were not on their own to find a place to live and then file for government assistance to pay for it. The cold weather will be here in two months and snow in three. Time is running out. Where is the housing for 50 or a 100 thousand going to come from?

IMHO, these FEMA programs are well intentioned and effective to some degree. But their process is significantly inadequate to meet the needs of the present situation. FEMA needs to provide housing, not an application process for people with no resources to navigate.

There's always a tension between trying to get resources as quickly to victims and making sure that those resources are spent where they're supposed to be spent. If you don't have any processes in place to document and ensure that the folks getting the resources are people who are entitled to the resources, then your program is susceptible to waste, fraud, and abuse. Not only does that result in an immediate loss of resources to the folks who need it, but it also makes your program incredibly vulnerable in later budgeting years.

We (meaning voters) tend to put competing and inconsistent demands on government programs. We want them to be customer-friendly and super-effective at completing their mission; and we want them to make sure that taxpayer dollars don't go to someone who shouldn't get them. They can't possibly do both, so the ones that err on the side of protecting taxpayer funds are criticized for being overly bureaucratic and difficult to navigate, and the ones that err on the side of emphasizing ease of access get criticized for having waste fraud and abuse.

Where is the housing for 50 or a 100 thousand going to come from?

Good question to ask Republicans in congress whose “thoughts and prayers” are the usual response to requests for FEMA funding.

As you indicate, thoughts and prayers will not pay for construction and long term assistance.

But I am sure you join me in thinking and praying that Congress should get off their fat keisters and fund disaster assistance at greater levels than they have been willing to do.

Of course, for them to admit that they have been short sighted would be for them to relinquish an election strategy that would rather wallow in the misery and blame Harris for the problem.

bighairymike: Treat these flood victims as if they were migrants, and by that the migrants were not on their own to find a place to live and then file for government assistance to pay for it. The cold weather will be here in two months and snow in three. Time is running out. Where is the housing for 50 or a 100 thousand going to come from?

First, where did you get this "50 or a 100 thousand" estimate? Second, unlike many migrants, most people here have families and friends who may be able to take them in.

And as FEMA has said, over 1,700 people who cannot return home are have already been moved to safe and clean lodging through FEMA’s Transitional Sheltering Assistance program. More will be relocated.

Information about locally available shelters is there if you look for it.

For example, Congressman Chuck Edwards of the 11th District in NC provides nearly daily updates on where to go for food, water, pharmacies, healthcare access, internet access, and more.

Here's his update on shelter:


For those unable to evacuate to a safe location or in need of a place to go, the following shelters are currently open and available as of October 5:

Buncombe
A-B Technical Community College
340 Victoria Rd., Asheville, NC 28801

Gold’s Gym
801 Fairview Rd, Asheville, NC 28803

WNC Agricultural Center
1301 Fanning Bridge Rd., Fletcher, NC 28732

Haywood
Haywood County Government Armory
285 Armory Dr., Clyde, NC 28781

Henderson
Edneyville Elementary School
2875 Pace Rd., Hendersonville, NC 28792

Henderson County Recreation Center
708 S. Grove St., Hendersonville, NC 28792

Madison
Madison Early College High School
5374 US Hwy 25-70, Marshall, NC 28755

McDowell
Glenwood Baptist Church
1550 Glenwood Baptist Church Rd., Marion, NC 29640

YMCA of Western North Carolina
348 Grace Corpening Dr., Marion, NC 28752

Polk
Polk County High School
1681 NC 108 Hwy. E., Columbus, NC 28722

Rutherford
Rutherfordton/Spindale Central High School
641 US 221 Hwy. N., Rutherfordton, NC 28139

Transylvania
Transylvania Parks & Rec
1078 Ecusta Rd., Brevard, NC 28712

Yancey
Blue Ridge Elementary
910 Cane River School Rd., Burnsville, NC 28714

Cane River Middle School
1128 Cane River School Rd., Burnsville, NC 28714


Contrary to the lies you're hearing from DonOLD Trump and JD Vance, the governors of the states hit by the hurricane have all said the federal government has been great and they're getting everything they ask for.

And they didn't have to kiss Joe Biden's ass once.


https://edwards.house.gov/media/press-releases/hur...

The cold weather will be here in two months and snow in three. Time is running out. Where is the housing for 50 or a 100 thousand going to come from?

Wonderful idea and of course we need to help our fellow Americans. How do you propose to pay for this? Would you be OK if your taxes increased to pay for this?

And Republican Mike Johnson is sitting on his hands instead of funding FEMA to do just what you propose. Why do you think he is he waiting?

As an aside, the questions I have is why do we allow people to build houses in flood zones to begin with? And why do my tax dollars go to insure homes of people who decide to build homes in flood zones over and over and over?

bighairymike: Treat these flood victims as if they were migrants

Great idea Mike! You always have such good ideas. (With the help of Fox News of course.)
We can use Trumps migrant policy...
Under this policy:
Adult migrants were prosecuted and sent to federal jails, and their children were taken from them. (Trump initially denied that family separations were happening. More lies.)
Trumps policy led to the separation of thousands of families:
Over 5,500 children, including infants, were separated from their parents.
As of March 2024, about 2,000 children still have not been reunited with their families.

Let's hear it for those MAGA "christian" values! Amen!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trump_administration...

As an aside, the questions I have is why do we allow people to build houses in flood zones to begin with? And why do my tax dollars go to insure homes of people who decide to build homes in flood zones over and over and over?

And that is the long term question, perhaps not so much for North Carolina as it is for the Gulf and lower Atlantic coast.


In Galveston, right now, Galveston authorities have approved the construction of high rise condos on a stretch of beach that was washed away by a hurricane that hit there less than two decades ago- lured into approval by the millions in property taxes that this property would generate. And of course, there are suckers born every minute who will buy these condos. At some point, they will lose those condos. Those with means will simply write off the loss. Those who scrimped to buy those condos will be left with nothing, because what insurance company in its right mind will insure a property that will most likely be gone in a few decades (or sooner)?

Rinse and repeat.

The lure of taxes generated lures local governments.

The fear of being perceived as authoritarian prohibits the feds from imposing bans on construction.

It has been the case that insurance companies have backstopped a great deal of this foolishness, but increasingly they are backing out of that suckers’ game.

But meanwhile, we’re on the hook for the victims, whether they be victims of charlatans or victims of their own desire to own a “little piece of paradise”, or victims of storms that are increasingly more dangerous…. Or victims of all three.

At least for the gulf coast where sea levels are rising more rapidly than in other places, this problem should resolve itself before the end of the century.

Reality has a way forcing solutions to seemingly intractable problems.

Fun facts:

The highest elevation on Galveston island is 20 feet above sea level.

The average elevation on Galveston island is 7 ft above sea level.

The highest point on the entire Gulf coast from Mobile Bay to the Yucatan is High Island Texas which sits on a small salt dome, at 45 ft. above sea level.

Sea levels in Galveston, Texas are rising at a rate of nearly 1 inch per year., and that rate is increasing.

Do the math.

Do the math.

Sure. It’ll take 84 years to build a small sea wall.

Sure. It’ll take 84 years to build a small sea wall.

Galveston is just now starting a multi-billion dollar project to protect the island. They already have a sea wall and habe already raised the level of the entire downtown area (in wake of 1900 storm)

This project will lengthen the sea wall and raise it higher. They’re also adding beach berms beyond the sea wall, gigantic pumps to be able to drain lower areas of the city- an increasing problem that is happening more frequently in rainstorms that increasingly back up the storm sewers due to rising sea level.
But perhaps the biggest and most expensive part of the project (collectively known as “The Big Dike”) is the one mile long gate that will be istalled across the Houston Ship Channel at the opening to Galveston Bay.

Anchored by Galveston Island on the ssw, and Boliver Peninsula on the ENE, this gate will normally remain open to ship and boat traffic, but will be closed during hurricanes.

The purpose? To block waters flowing into Galveston Bay that would flood the bayside of the island. They even have consulted with Dutch engineers who have a long history of constructing such things.

The problems, of course, in addition to the initial expense of billions, will be the cost of operation and replentishment of the sand berms and dunes which form an integral part of the strategy.

And of course, there’s an underlying problem- the increasing rate of sea level rise (which you didn’t account for when you did the math).

IMHO, these FEMA programs are well intentioned and effective to some degree. But their process is significantly inadequate to meet the needs of the present situation. FEMA needs to provide housing, not an application process for people with no resources to navigate.

Imagine the shrieks from Conservatives if we were building vacant government housing all over the place and leaving it there “just in case.” And where do you build it? South Carolina? Florida? And do you tell people in New Orleans that they have to go live in George for a while? Heck, I remember a lot of displacement in New York after a hurricane. Where are you going to put those people, Wyoming?

And in California after an earthquake, and in Kansas after tornadoes, and in …

I don’t think you’ve thought this through. If there are realistic opportunities for improvement I’m all for them. “Finding them housing” on a scale of thousands or tens-of-thousands on two days notice probably isn’t it.

These people literally have nothing!

All of a sudden social services, aka socialism, is MAGA great.

Wow. No empathy or even acknowledgment expressed at all for these helpless victims. And six rec's too.

Bring's to mind Trump's bashing California when disasters occurred here.... until he was told there were red voters in some areas.

"Treat these flood victims as if they were migrants, and by that the migrants were not on their own to find a place to live and then file for government assistance to pay for it. "

I don't know which is greater, your ignorance or your assholeness.

Since you insist on comparing apples to oranges, maybe we should put all of the people who lost their homes to Helene/Milton in cages and separate the children from the families.

bighairymike: Treat these flood victims as if they were migrants, and by that the migrants were not on their own to find a place to live and then file for government assistance to pay for it.

As every republican governor and many republican state politicians have said, the federal government response to Hurricane Helene has been excellent. President Biden approved disaster relief before Hurricane Helene made landfall.

Nearly 7,000 personnel from across the federal workforce are on site, including FEMA staff. To date, FEMA has shipped over 15.6 million meals, more than 13.9 million liters of water, 157 generators and more than 505,000 tarps to the region.

In North Carolina, FEMA has approved more than $32 million in housing and other types of assistance for over 27,000 households.

Over 1,200 Urban Search and Rescue personnel remain in the field helping people. These teams have rescued or supported over 3,200 survivors to date. 1,500 active-duty military personnel have been deployed. 22 shelters are available for housing. More than 86% of originally reported power outages have been restored.

In Florida, FEMA has approved more than $87 million for over 13,000 households. FEMA specialists are canvassing Florida communities affected by Helene to help survivors apply for assistance.

In South Carolina, FEMA has approved over $57 million for more than 73,500 households.

In Georgia, FEMA has approved over $31 million for more than 39,000 households.

WTF do you want? You're pissed that FEMA hasn't rebuilt these people's houses yet? FEMA doesn't do that.

Funny, republicans didn't have their panties in a twist when Orange Jesus withheld about $20 billion in hurricane relief for Puerto Rico following the devastating aftermath of Hurricane Maria in 2017, one of the deadliest U.S. natural disasters in over 100 years.

Hurricane Maria killed 2,975 people and triggered the world's second-longest blackout yet Trump repeatedly opposed disaster funding for Puerto Rico while disputing and failing to acknowledge Maria's death toll.

Trump delayed aid to Puerto Rico for two years.

You think maybe they suffered from that malicious neglect?

Funny, I don't recall any of the republicans here giving a rat's ass about them then.


https://www.fema.gov/press-release/20241007/federa...

And of course, there’s an underlying problem- the increasing rate of sea level rise (which you didn’t account for when you did the math).

Okay, so not 84 years. More like 60.

We’re screwed if the volcano under the Antarctic ice shelf blows, eh?

WTF do you want? You're pissed that FEMA hasn't rebuilt these people's houses yet? FEMA doesn't do that.

They just want to play the blame game and the right wing media feeds them all the bullshit they need to fertilize their febrile imaginations.

Okay, so not 84 years. More like 60.

That only gets you to an elevation of 0 feet above sea level. Knock off a couple of more decades to account for storm surge.

To be clear, I am not complaining that standard home insurance does not include flood insurance. If it was included, the cost of HO insurance would sky rocket for everybody and most people don't need it.

Requiring everyone to have it would make it cheaper, not costlier IMHO, because not everyone needs it every year. Socialism!

Getting back to the point I as making, there is a huge and looming problem with flood victims, especially in remote areas,

Yes, and Mike Johnson just said wait till after the election for additional funding. So politics are played with emergencies. Fema does provide trailers and so can the state, or you can rent and get assistance.

WTF do you want? You're pissed that FEMA hasn't rebuilt these people's houses yet? FEMA doesn't do that. - CO

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First of all, I am glad to see all that relief you listed. It is not apparent that any of that was being used to construct new temporary housing that is needed now and which will remain occupied for the next year or two.

Pissed is the wrong word, I am concerned that many people will not have shelter when the the winter comes. And WTF is this fiction about me suggesting rebuilding peoples individual homes. That can't be done until after months and months of debris removal, road and bridge construction, and services like water and electricity are restored. I am not talking about the larger cities where most of the aid you list is being consumed. This is in the remote areas, small towns and communities spread all through the mountains.

Rebuilding peoples homes will come when it comes. But winter is coming real soon and many victims need something now, What comes to mind are the large migrant shelters that were put up on short notice in cities like NYC. If FEMA doesn't provide enough interim shelters for the next 1 or 2 years, then who does?

>>>And of course, there’s an underlying problem- the increasing rate of sea level rise (which you didn’t account for when you did the math).<<<

Okay, so not 84 years. More like 60. - Dope

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The word "subsidence" is missing from the convesation.

And yes I am savvy enough to konw about flood plains, flood maps and how to use the internet

I'm not sure you understand me Mike. So look at this. https://pubs.usgs.gov/wri/1976/0017/report.pdf

If you go to page 26, any station number starting on 03 is in Western N Carolina. Some of the 02s are too, but the 03 is definite from looking at the maps.

So look down the names of where the stations are, the drainage area, the years of unregulated record, the magnitude of flood in cubic feet per second for 2yr, 5yr, 10, 25, 50, and 100 year intervals. Now look at those. And they include some estimates. Ashville river is about half way down the page, but look at all of the rest of the locations and intervals. Look at how many years of record they've got. This is what I'm talking about.

The word "subsidence" is missing from the convesation

That too adds to the problem.

When da land be sinking and da water be rising all at same time, bruddah, you gotta big problem, fo sho

"Trump delayed aid to Puerto Rico for two years.

You think maybe they suffered from that malicious neglect?

Funny, I don't recall any of the republicans here giving a rat's ass about them then."

To be fair to them, I am pretty sure a good chunk of the Republican base thought Puerto Rico was a foreign country.

Have no fear, Project 2025 will defund both FEMA and NOAA.

I am pretty sure a good chunk of the Republican base thought Puerto Rico was a foreign country.

More importantly, Trump knows they can’t vote for him, so to him they’re useless.

—Peter

I saw a news story a few months ago that some areas still haven't restored reliable power. One civilian had taken it upon himself to fix what he could in his neighborhood, because it wasn't getting done through "official" channels.

This wasn't the story, but it is related: https://www.nyu.edu/about/news-publications/news/2...

At least Biden didn't throw paper towels at them.

bighairymike writes:

<<The FEMA programs that I can find anyway all require and victim to file paperwork, then go find a hotel, and FEMA will pay for it for a while. Or FEMA may lease some available vacation homes, etc and assign one to you for up to 18 months as I recall.>>

Look harder, or merely watch or read something other than the crap you attend to.

<<Treat these flood victims as if they were migrants, and by that the migrants were not on their own to find a place to live and then file for government assistance to pay for it.>>

Shame on you. Seriously.

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