Post New

So a local homeless camp decided to expand their operations into waylaying drivers in an attempt to carjack them:
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/seattle-offic...

The cops were able to run him down but unfortunately stirred up a literal hornets' nest.

The suspect would block traffic to stop the vehicles and attempt to take the cars, witnesses told authorities. Police said the suspect caused significant damage to some vehicles as they passed.

Officers eventually found the suspect in a tunnel on Dexter Way North beneath Aurora Avenue North.

I live near there. There's video of him leaping out at cars with a knife. Not the most competent carjacker ever.
If this were down south or in parts of the midwest this guy would have had a bumper-sized indentation in his pelvis along with tire tracks on his forehead, but this is passive Seattle, so...

He's from - of course - a local homeless camp.


Then there are these tactics:
https://www.kiro7.com/news/local/attempted-carjack...

Carjackers are targeting new victims every week in King County. One specific method is the latest trend -- suspects stage a fender bender and when the victim is out of the car, someone gets out a gun and takes the car by force.

..
'I ducked down and I put it in first gear and I took off,' she said.

Then she said the man with the gun opened fire, firing a shot at her car.

'I was going very fast because I was hoping to see a police officer somewhere. They chased me for a good five or six miles,' Yaya said.

Sweet. Now they're shooting at cars. You know what Seattle and King County need? More virtue signaling. That'll fix it.

Dope1: So a local homeless camp decided...He's from - of course - a local homeless camp.

Nothing in your link mentions a homeless camp.

And your anecdotes pale in comparison to the threat of the likely republican party presidential nominee wanting to execute a four-star military officer, shut down a television news network, and urging republicans to shut down the government in the hope that president Biden is blamed.

Nothing in your link mentions a homeless camp.

So? I live here. You don't. I know the area very well.

You don't.
That hillside and general area have been problematic for the last few years.

The rest of your post is a rant about whatever you think gins up the most Outrageous Outrage you think you can muster (because that's your job).

Here's what you don't get:

You're speculating on what you want to believe a Republican President would do.


I'm telling you what's happening right now under democrat 'leadership'.

In a contest between programmed talking points and actual reality'reality always wins.

"And your anecdotes pale in comparison to the threat of the likely.... republican party presidential nominee wanting to execute a four-star military officer,.... shut down a television news network, .....and urging republicans to shut down the government in the hope that president Biden is blamed."

Hyperbole is a weak form of debate .,.. not to be taken seriously .

And your anecdotes pale in comparison to the threat of the likely republican party presidential nominee wanting to execute a four-star military officer

Stop manipulation the words Trump said and turn his intent into a lie.

You've already been caught doing this.

You've already been caught doing this.

Like Boater pointed out, hyperbole and/or just making up stuff is a pretty weaksauce tactic.

But back to the subject of the thread.

How bad are blue cities? This bad:
https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/oaklan...


https://archive.ph/4Wcq9

Hundreds of businesses in Oakland plan to participate in a one-day strike Tuesday, protesting rising crime in the city and calling on city officials to help struggling merchants.
The strike is set to start at 10 a.m. with a news conference at Le Cheval, a downtown restaurant that announced it is closing after 38 years due to crime and slow sales post-pandemic, according to a flyer distributed by the local NAACP chapter.
Some merchants plan to close their doors for the whole day, while others just for a couple of hours, said Carl Chan, a public safety advocate in Chinatown. He said a majority of businesses participating are small convenience stores, as well as restaurants throughout the city.

That's right. Dozens of small businesses are basically saying, 'things are so bad it's worth it for us to not be open and lose money to bring awareness to how things are'.

That's life in blue cities under perpetual democrat leadership.

Does anyone want this at a national level? The sane answer is 'NO'.

bighairymike: Hyperbole is a weak form of debate .,.. not to be taken seriously .

Facts are facts.

Fact 1. Donald Trump, on his social-media network, Truth Social, wrote that Mark Milley's phone call to reassure China in the aftermath of the storming of the Capitol on January 6, 2021, was "an act so egregious that, in times gone by, the punishment would have been DEATH."

Fact 2. "They are almost all dishonest and corrupt, but Comcast, with its one-side and vicious coverage by NBC NEWS, and in particular MSNBC, often and correctly referred to as MSDNC (Democrat National Committee!), should be investigated for its 'Country Threatening Treason.' I say up front, openly, and proudly, that when I WIN the Presidency of the United States, they and others of the LameStream Media will be thoroughly scrutinized for their knowingly dishonest and corrupt coverage of people, things, and events. The Fake News Media should pay a big price for what they have done to our once great Country!"

Fact 3. "The Republicans lost big on Debt Ceiling, got NOTHING, and now are worried that they will be BLAMED for the Budget Shutdown. Wrong!!! Whoever is President will be blamed,' Trump wrote in the post, adding: 'UNLESS YOU GET EVERYTHING, SHUT IT DOWN!"

So, no, not hyperbole. But the cult is deaf and blind.


https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2023/09/...

https://thehill.com/homenews/4221310-trump-pledges...

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/congress/trump-br...

Facts are facts.
Yep, and there are 40 other TDS threads for you to park all the Outrageous Outrage on whatever message you were instructed to spread around the internet.

Meanwhile, back to the subject at hand:
https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/law-just...

Seattle has surpassed 2022 homicide toll ' with 3 months left in 2023

Still have a whole quarter to go!

Facts. They're...facts.

bighairymike: Hyperbole is a weak form of debate .,.. not to be taken seriously . - CO

---------------------

Sorry, it is easy to get me and boater confused since we are both magnificent, insightful and well informed conservatives.

While I don't like how he made his point (in fact, it wasn't clear at first), I think his point is that that is governing as done under Republicans.

There are blue cities, and blue states, that are doing just fine. I'm sorry your home isn't one of them. I would be complaining, too, if I lived there. And I have been there, so I have seen the druggies and vagrants on the street near the metro above Pike Market (and all the way to the Starbucks with the big vats). Also lots of police, so I never really felt endangered. But it is a mess.

OTOH, Tucson is mostly fine. Problems like any other city, but it's fine. Used to live there. Blue as they come. And they're less than an hour from the border. There really are TWO Tucsons...the south, which is poorer, Hispanic, and great Mexican food places, and north/east which is more typical middle class. The only complaint I ever really had was that they couldn't maintain the streets very well. Lots of patching, not enough repaving. Lots of stuff between the university and the downtown area (eateries, improv clubs, etc). Ironically, the university is probably in the most problematic area of the city.

Dope: "Nothing in your link mentions a homeless camp.

So? I live here. You don't. I know the area very well.

You don't.
That hillside and general area have been problematic for the last few years."

I don't doubt for a minute that a shirtless guy with a knife who flees into urban shrubbery resides in a homeless encampment. The knife is the weapon most frequently used by homeless criminals since they cannot afford guns & ammo.

My community has a homeless encampment along side a drainage stream bed whose current denizens have taken to running from the shrubbery surrounding their encampment onto the adjacent section of road where cars turn in and out of a shopping center. It's a 25mph zone so, done right, the homeless "victim" can limp away with a cash extortion.

Last month a guy misjudged the drivers intent; thought the car was turning left into the supermarket parking lot, but the driver went straight! Instead of the glancing blow off the right fender, the guy got flattened. He was hospitalized with quite a few broken bones, but insisted on self-discharging from the hospital in a wheelchair.

2 nights ago one of the homeless guys shot out of the bushes into the turn lane on a bicycle, but the lady stopped in time. Freaked her out! Several people on social media have reported similar experiences at that location.

These incidents don't make the papers, but social media buzzes with each one.

Did the earth just move.. me accepting Dope's local knowledge?

Here's another earth shaker: Gavin Newsome is having the AG challenge the 9th District court that ruled cities cannot ban camping sidewalks and public parks.
My DA relatives in Oakland predicted there would be a breaking point where liberal city/county/state officers can't ignore the filth and crime that accompany urban camping.

While I don't like how he made his point (in fact, it wasn't clear at first), I think his point is that that is governing as done under Republicans.


You're giving him far too much credit. He's pulling a bunch of rants from Truth Social or wherever he gets them from and is extrapolating what he thinks Trump will do if elected again.

What he desperately wants to construct is a phony baloney math statement that says "Fever dream Trump 2nd term <<<<<< blue city crime and public safety" and avoid talking about the latter as much as possible.

Me, being a resident of a place that used to be one of the world's gems before a laissez-faire drug policy and depolicing/harm reduction/restorative justice combo piledrived the city...ain't playing that game. I'm glad Tuscon is still good, though.

Me, being a resident of a place that used to be one of the world's gems before a laissez-faire drug policy and depolicing/harm reduction/restorative justice combo piledrived the city...ain't playing that game.

So, if we assume people on both sides of the aisle are aware of the problem, why do you think nothing is being done? Granted, I was just a visitor, but I did see an area of vagrancy and open drug use. Not everywhere I went, but that area I described previously. So it is apparent. Please don't just ascribe it to stupidity. I'm sure some officials are, and some voters are. That is everywhere. But enough voters are electing these people, and even assuming a normal distribution of intelligence, most of them aren't going to be stupid.

One more anecdote.... my Mom, Oakland DA, daughter (tres generaciones de mujeres) visited last Sunday.

Daughter reports that in addition to the widespread breaking of parked car windows, the new 'thing' is breaking the windows on cars occupied by women at stoplights and grabbing their purses at knifepoint.

I have a hunch this isn't necessarily all 'homeless people' crime, but also young thugs who are simply urban thugs.

Not a bad idea for ladies to keep a can of bear spray in their door side panel. Me, I like my short aluminum baseball bat.

"......the FBI arrested two men and charged them with attacking U.S. Capitol Police Officer Brian D. Sicknick with an unknown chemical spray during the Jan. 6 riot. Charging papers allege that one of the men said to the other, 'Give me that bear s---,' before later spraying a substance into Sicknick's face. Sicknick died Jan. 7. Capitol police have said Sicknick 'was injured while physically engaging with protesters.' A cause of death has not been determined.

Whether Sicknick's death is related to bear spray or not, news reports from around the United States and Canada show that it is increasingly being used as a weapon against humans rather than for its intended purpose: to protect hikers, campers and backcountry workers from bears.

"Facts are facts."


Yes, facts are facts. It is a fact that this statement is untrue.

" republican party presidential nominee wanting to execute a four-star military officer,"

It is also a fact that statement is also untrue
" shut down a television news network, "

Fact OK, not hyperbole, out right lying if you prefer.

"o, no, not hyperbole. But the cult is deaf and blind."

Boater (right guy this time): It is a fact that this statement is untrue.

I GAVE YOU THE ACTUAL TRUMP QUOTES AND LINKS FOR EACH STATEMENT.

Yes, I'm yelling because you must be hard of hearing.

Or is this a Shawshank moment?

"Yes, I'm yelling because you must be hard of hearing.

Or is this a Shawshank moment?"

No, this seems to be a lack of comprehension moment. Sad.

Here's another earth shaker: Gavin Newsome is having the AG challenge the 9th District court that ruled cities cannot ban camping sidewalks and public parks.
My DA relatives in Oakland predicted there would be a breaking point where liberal city/county/state officers can't ignore the filth and crime that accompany urban camping.

Yes, I think an accommodation needs to be made so that cities can clean up,

"'While I agree with the basic principle that a city shouldn't criminalize homeless individuals for sleeping outside when they have nowhere else to go within that city's boundaries, courts continue to reach well beyond that narrow limit to block any number of reasonable efforts to protect homeless individuals and the broader public from the harms of uncontrolled encampments,' Newsom said in a statement.

'It's time for the courts to stop these confusing, impractical and costly rulings that only serve to worsen this humanitarian crisis,' he said."

Some encampments go beyond being eyesores and nuisances.

my Mom, Oakland DA, daughter (tres generaciones de mujeres) visited last Sunday.

Daughter reports that in addition to the widespread breaking of parked car windows, the new 'thing' is breaking the windows on cars occupied by women at stoplights and grabbing their purses at knifepoint.

I have a hunch this isn't necessarily all 'homeless people' crime, but also young thugs who are simply urban thugs.

Not a bad idea for ladies to keep a can of bear spray in their door side panel....

"......the FBI arrested two men and charged them with attacking U.S. Capitol Police Officer Brian D. Sicknick with an unknown chemical spray during the Jan. 6 riot.


Your juxtaposition prompted a thought. There's a whole segment of the American populace who frighteningly downplays the cause, the nature, the violence, and the import of what took place on Jan 6. And one of the effects of this reality reversal is that it functions to legitimize the impulse to and use of violence in general.

When Obama won the rapist Trump tweeted,

"The electoral college is a disaster for a democracy.

We can't let this happen. We should march on Washington and stop this travesty. Our nation is totally divided!"

' Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) November 7, 2012

Anybody who does not see the parallels to the ascendance of the 3rd Reich is blind to reality. Trump's ranting that he'd like to charge anybody who opposes him with treason rants are pure projection on his part. Exciting the Trumpenkult with promises of a purge, Trump's in full tyrant mode.

Speaking of Trumps kult ... another leafleting by Trump 's supporters in my county this week.

https://calcoastnews.com/2023/09/antisemitic-flyer...

Not to get into the habit of defending Trump (or Boater), but I don't think the accusation that Trump called for Milley's execution would stand up in court. Trump said:

"[Milley committed] an act so egregious that, in times gone by, the punishment would have been DEATH."

Trump did not say "Milley should be executed" or "I want Milley to be executed" or "I will execute Milley if reelected".

But IANAL.

Not to get into the habit of defending Trump (or Boater), but I don't think the accusation that Trump called for Milley's execution would stand up in court. Trump said:

"[Milley committed] an act so egregious that, in times gone by, the punishment would have been DEATH."

Trump did not say "Milley should be executed" or "I want Milley to be executed" or "I will execute Milley if reelected".
-------------------------------------
I think it's enough that we have doubts because of his code speak. But y'all can stand back and stand by, and go find some votes if you want, won't bother me.

But y'all can stand back and stand by, and go find some votes if you want, won't bother me.

TBH, I never thought that Trump saying "stand back and stand by" proved much either. He said it exasperatedly after being prompted by live questioning to condemn them, and "stand by" could have been a simple unfortunate use of language. Perhaps he really meant "stand down". Trump isn't exactly a master of vocabulary or language or coherent thought.

So, if we assume people on both sides of the aisle are aware of the problem, why do you think nothing is being done? Granted, I was just a visitor, but I did see an area of vagrancy and open drug use. Not everywhere I went, but that area I described previously. So it is apparent. Please don't just ascribe it to stupidity. I'm sure some officials are, and some voters are. That is everywhere. But enough voters are electing these people, and even assuming a normal distribution of intelligence, most of them aren't going to be stupid.

There aren't "both sides of the aisle" in many blue cities: they operate under 1-party rule. Seattle elected its first Republican to any citywide position in over 40 years when Ann Davison assumed the office of city prosecutor.

As for how or why things got the way they are...that was by design.

You live in a reasonably reddish/purple state. Those of us who live in deep blue states don't have a moderating effect of a 2nd party. All there is are versions of democrat. So that means that policies that are marketed to "Give people a second chance" are put into place. And that means government is the solution to everything and individual agency doesn't factor in. At all.

Seattle, Denver, LA, San Francisco, Oakland, Portland, you name it have all put in the exact same set of policies that

1. Decriminalize and destigmatize drug use
2. Assume that poverty is the root cause of homelessness, not drug use
3. Assume that there is an infinite golden goose that can lay as many tax dollar eggs as the cities can spend
4. Overpolicing is a huge problem, and as such diversionary programs and no cash bail are needed.
5. Treat many crimes as "survival crimes" owing to (2) and don't charge the perpetrators for them (witness shoplifting's explosion)

The ripple effects of those DISASTROUS policy decisions spread beyond the city and into the suburbs in no time. Meanwhile, small businesses are shoplifted out of existence, crime explodes, public transit becomes unusable, parks and public spaces become overrun with encampments, drugs and violent incidents, and the criminals you didn't prosecute graduate to more serious crimes.

And once a downtown is dead, people move away. That's how you doomloop a city.

In summary, decades of voting in the same people with the same ideas have led us to urban policies that full of carrots but require zero accountability on the part of the people receiving the aid.

https://www.cbsnews.com/colorado/news/denver-busin...


LOCAL NEWS
Businessman Jon Caldera dumps human poop on steps of Denver City and County Building

"This is a present from the homeless to the people who have kept this homeless problem going," he said.

President of the Independence Institute -- a think tank in downtown Denver -- Caldera says he's tired of the homeless using his private property as their public restroom.

He says at least twice a week security cameras catch a homeless person defecating outside his business or worse.

"We have to clean up vomit and urine and syringes and used condoms and feces. We didn't cause the homeless problem in Denver but we have clean up after it," Caldera said.

Caldera says he's tried appealing to police and Johnston to no avail. The answer he says isn't tiny homes, it's jail cells.

Bolding mine. This guy is 100% correct. You could clean these places up through use more sticks instead of infinite carrots.

g0177325: Not to get into the habit of defending Trump (or Boater), but I don't think the accusation that Trump called for Milley's execution would stand up in court.

So who's suggesting Trump should be indicted, besides no one?

Representative Paul Gosar understood Trump and replied: "In a better society, quislings like the strange sodomy-promoting General Milley would be hung."

Mark Esper, Trump's former defense secretary understood Trump and replied: "Well, first of all, that statement by the president is horrible. It's intolerable. It should be condemned by everybody, right, left, Republican, Democrat."

Besides, Esper explained, Milley never did what Trump suggested: "Mark Milley did what I directed him to do, he did what other chairmen had done in the past, which, I think is responsible diplomacy and statecraft to prevent mishaps from happening."

If Trump is suggesting that "in times gone by" Milley would have been put to death then it's perfectly rational to reply that "in times gone by" a candidate making such an outrageous statement would have been condemned by his own party and driven out of the presidential campaign.

In times gone by a president saying the Aisne-Marne American Cemetery was "filled with losers" would have outraged the republican party. Republicans didn't even blink.

Stop normalizing Trump's inane, insane autocratic behavior. Whether or not Trump's statement would be prosecutable is not the issue here.

Anybody who does not see the parallels to the ascendance of the 3rd Reich is blind to reality.

To be fair, most Americans are unaware of the details of the ascendance of the Third Reich.

I've been calling out the similarities since the 2016 primaries. The Atlantic published an article right after the election that made the same observations I had made. It was a scary time for anyone who knew the history of the 1920s-30s. Still is, because that movement hasn't died the death it should have.

And today there is a complication. China. If the US ends up in a civil war, or something similar, China will take advantage. They've already been pretty overt at seizing territory they have no right to. Especially when the previous administration didn't have any interest in Asia, and left a void that China was more than happy to try to fill (e.g. canceling a major trade deal unilaterally...it had its problems, but we just walked away and left Asia-Pacific to deal with China alone). And then, I'm sure, Russia would be pleased with the distraction that would cause.

It's a perilous time to be disconnected from reality, as a large portion of the populace today is.

Stop normalizing Trump's inane, insane autocratic behavior. Whether or not Trump's statement would be prosecutable is not the issue here.

I don't condone what Trump said in the slightest. It was reckless and dangerous since it risks inciting others to violence, perhaps even intentionally so. But he didn't call for Milley's execution, however strong the indirect implication might appear. That's all I'm trying to say. That said, Trump is a danger to democracy and his reelection would be a complete disaster for the U.S. and the world.

And the people aren't demanding change? That's where the disconnect for me is. Either people are OK with it, or they're writing their mayor/officials, showing up to meetings, and voting people out. If that's not happening, then the implication is that a majority of people are OK with it.

Arizona has pockets of blue, but is mostly red. So there isn't that much tension in most races. Often, people run unopposed, or there will be multiple "R" candidates for a slot. The only reason we have no Rep senators is because McSally lost both seats to Dems (at different times, obviously). Because she was just so awful. And a Dem governor because Lake was (and is) nuts. My district? Solid red since I moved here.

And once a downtown is dead, people move away. That's how you doomloop a city. - Dope

------------------

When this outcome inevitably happens, remember to blame it on white flight. damn racists.....

And the people aren't demanding change? That's where the disconnect for me is. Either people are OK with it, or they're writing their mayor/officials, showing up to meetings, and voting people out. If that's not happening, then the implication is that a majority of people are OK with it.

Voters *Aren't* okay with it.
But what happens when you suggest something that even REMOTELY looks like a conservative policy suggestion in a liberal town?

You get labeled as a Trumpist J6 revolutionary and then nothing happens.

That's not hyperbole; that's how it is - there is a healthy Housing First/Harm Reduction activist class that holds sway over local politicians to make sure of that.

When the store closings start, they look like this
https://www.cnbc.com/2023/09/26/target-says-it-wil...

Target
said Tuesday that it will close nine stores in major cities across the country, citing violence, theft and organized retail crime.

The company will close one store in New York City's Harlem neighborhood, two locations in Seattle, three stores in the San Francisco-Oakland area and three more in Portland, Oregon. The discounter said it will shutter the stores for good on Oct. 21.

A judge in New York has ordered that former President Donald Trump, his eldest sons and his business associates committed fraud.
Judge Arthur Engoron issued an order Tuesday granting partial summary judgment in the lawsuit filed by New York's Democratic Attorney General Letitia James.

Did he tell his boys "Let's defraud some financial institutions in the following manner to benefit ourselves fraudulently?"

Of course not.

Did he say "stand back and stand by to disrupt the electoral procedure in the Capital building on Jan6?"

Of course not.

A disciple of Roy Cohn, Trump knows deniability is essential. Trump has gotten great mileage out of insinuating and suggesting 'what should be," stanching critics with bluster and lies.

That's why Al Capone didn't go up the river for the violence his people perpetrated. They got him on a tax rap.

I believe justice will prevail and Trump will be convicted for some of the crimes he has perpetrated.

The only reason we have no Rep senators is because McSally lost both seats to Dems (at different times, obviously). Because she was just so awful.

Bingo. The reason the western states rarely elect Republicans is not because there are no good republicans, but because the craziest loudest most fascist republicans are commandeering the party with their hateful racist, bigoted, anti-science, misogynist planks.

Look...there's a reason the racist, fascist, religios are united behind an amoral comb-over rapist fraud. He validates their hatred.

You get labeled as a Trumpist J6 revolutionary and then nothing happens.

Yes, some do because they are.

And, even if they dispute the J6 label, they align with other anti-science, misogynist, racist, ammosexual, christo-fascist, election denying, QANON regurgitating groups who back amoral politicians who kiss the ring of the orange rapist who wants vengeance on all who won't kiss the ring.

Arnold the terminator is pretty crazy, but far from crazy enough to slither under the limbo bar the trumpenkult is holding.

Meme of the week: Menendez almost has enough provable allegations against him to run as a Republican.

TBH, I never thought that Trump saying "stand back and stand by" proved much either. He said it exasperatedly after being prompted by live questioning to condemn them, and "stand by" could have been a simple unfortunate use of language. Perhaps he really meant "stand down". Trump isn't exactly a master of vocabulary or language or coherent thought.

There's no sense talking about it then. The Proud Boys had a different idea than you about it.

Caldera says he's tried appealing to police and Johnston to no avail. The answer he says isn't tiny homes, it's jail cells.

Bolding mine. This guy is 100% correct. You could clean these places up through use more sticks instead of infinite carrots.

Why unhoused people in the US are choosing to go to jail: 'I kept reoffending'
People on the street who are resistant to shelters face a cruel choice: living rough in the cold or spending time behind bars


https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/nov/02/un...


There has to be a cheaper way than jail though..

I never thought that Trump saying "stand back and stand by" proved much either. He said it exasperatedly after being prompted by live questioning to condemn them, and "stand by" could have been a simple unfortunate use of language. Perhaps he really meant "stand down". Trump isn't exactly a master of vocabulary or language or coherent thought.

Wouldn't you agree, though, that Trump has had more than ample opportunity to clarify his statement, to express his objection to the Proud Boyz violent neo-fascist m.o. ?

So, why hasn't he, and why doesn't, he condemn the Proud Boyz, white nationalists, and religios that are weaponizing 'christianity'? Of course we both know the answer.

McCain had a moment when he famously corrected a white woman about Barak Obama's status as an American. He paid dearly for being honest and honorable in that moment.

So, why hasn't he, and why doesn't, he condemn the Proud Boyz, white nationalists, and religios that are weaponizing 'christianity'? Of course we both know the answer.

The more appropriate question is why DIDN'T he clarify his debate comment immediately after the debate? The clear, mob-like, purposely indirect comment was immediately noted by the press and public after the debate. The meaning that everyone inferred from the comment -- don't do anything right now but listen for my cue in case I need some muscle -- was so far outside the realm of acceptable talk from any politian, much less a sitting President, that anyone who DIDN'T mean that would have immediately clarified or retracted the comment in horror at phrasing anything so poorly.

Trump didn't say a word. THe furor that erupted across the country simply confirmed to him he provided his direction with EXACTLY the optimal amount of legal ambiguity yet its intent was perfectly understood, not only by the thugs he put on hold but the rest of the public who were put on notice that yes, this guy is corrupt enough to leverage armed militias to impose fear and chaos and direct actual armed violence against his enemies.

There wasn't a single person in the country who misinterpreted his comment. It was PERFECTLY clear what his intent was.


WTH

Wouldn't you agree, though, that Trump has had more than ample opportunity to clarify his statement, to express his objection to the Proud Boyz violent neo-fascist m.o. ?

Yes, that's true. His lack of any attempted clarification is telling.

So, why hasn't he, and why doesn't, he condemn the Proud Boyz, white nationalists, and religios that are weaponizing 'christianity'? Of course we both know the answer.

Well, even though he doesn't want to condemn them for fear of alienating a component of his base, I don't think clarifying his "stand back and stand by" statement would alienate his base.

McCain had a moment when he famously corrected a white woman about Barak Obama's status as an American. He paid dearly for being honest and honorable in that moment.

Yes, that was a true honorable thing for McCain to do. I always respected him for that. He is a decent man.

To be fair, most Americans are unaware of the details of the ascendance of the Third Reich.


Sometime after TFGs 2016 ascendancy - in pursuit of what understanding I could glean, or what I think of as my WTF interval - I read Erik Larson's "In the Garden of Beasts ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_the_Garden_of_Bea... ). It's the nonfiction account of FDR's first choice of US Ambassador to Germany, William Dodd, who had a front-row seat in Berlin from 1933 - 1937. (As well as the exploits of his, uh, adventurous daughter).

There's certainly an infinite amount to read on the topic, but this is my favorite to date for vividness and accessibility.

For me, there are too many similarities with the 1930s multiyear contest between a charismatic wannabe sociopathic tyrant and an eminence grise (in that case, Hindenburg) to not have me see the historical rhyming with the 2024 election. The dwindling of anything like accommodation for one's opponents; the head-shaking or outright disbelief of the other Western nations; the steady diminishing of the sole 80-something year-old man who was seen as the bulwark between the lunatic and the realization of his goals.

We won't talk about the ascendant Far East nation with its progressive militarization and land grabs.

--sutton

McCain had a moment when he famously corrected a white woman about Barak Obama's status as an American. He paid dearly for being honest and honorable in that moment.

How many of today's Republicans would do that? I suspect few, if any. And THAT is the power of the propaganda of right-wing media, which is why people (on both sides) need to source reliable media rather than the hysterical ranting sources many on the right rely upon (and a few on the left, but it mostly seems to be a right-wing problem).

At the time, I had never heard of Obama. I had a friend who was emailing his friends all sorts of nonsense. But I didn't know it was nonsense, so I was looking stuff up. And when I'd share what I found (i.e. it was nonsense), the group turned on me. Lost my best friend from high school because he couldn't accept that Obama was a natural born US citizen, among other things. Silly me...I thought those people wanted to know actual facts. They just wanted justification for their prejudices. (Tried reaching out a few years ago...silence. Apparently I'm not forgiven for seeking truth.)

Bingo.

The only real differences I see is that a) we don't have a parliamentary system (they did), and b) there is no way someone would be granted dictatorial powers without seizing them (Hitler was granted that as Chancellor, but Hindenburg was President and could override...until he died, which left Hitler unopposed).

Hadn't heard of that book. Sounds interesting.

Yes, history is rhyming with current events. It's scary for anyone who is paying attention, and knows a bit of history.

Sometime after TFGs 2016 ascendancy - in pursuit of what understanding I could glean, or what I think of as my WTF interval - I read Erik Larson's "In the Garden of Beasts ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_the_Garden_of_Bea... ). It's the nonfiction account of FDR's first choice of US Ambassador to Germany, William Dodd, who had a front-row seat in Berlin from 1933 - 1937.

Just finished reading this a few days ago. What stood out to me was that it was only in hindsight--after the invasion of Poland--that most people came to the realization of just how bad things would get in Germany. During his rise to power, the prevailing sentiment among the US government was that Hitler was someone we could "work with". While there were some red flags, it was not obvious to everyone what was going to happen.

While there were discussions and disagreements, it was not the thrust of US policy at the time to try to derail Hitler, and in fact there were some efforts to appease him (i.e. having discussions with Jewish leaders try to get them to temper protests in the US) in the hope of being able to have a productive relationship with him. There was also considerable sentiment that the US should keep our nose out of other countries' business, which worked until it didn't...

Then there was this description of Hitler by Ambassador Dodd: "His influence is and has been wholly belligerent." Remind you of anyone?

For Dope, the Hellscape in Dopistan: ;P


https://twitter.com/abughazalehkat/status/17067779...

For Dope, the Hellscape in Dopistan: ;P


https://twitter.com/abughazalehkat/status/17067779...

lapsody

==================

Liberals in denial.... nothing new about that. Same mindset that lets many of them believe there is no problem at the southern border.....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vn_PSJsl0LQ

For Dope, the Hellscape in Dopistan: ;P

LOL @ that clip.

Liberals in denial.... nothing new about that. Same mindset that lets many of them believe there is no problem at the southern border.....

Yep. The University of Washington just ran a NOTHING TO SEE HERE study about drugs on buses:

https://deohs.washington.edu/sites/default/files/2...

Assessing
fentanyl and
methamphetamine
in the air and on
surfaces of transit
vehicles

UW researchers analyzed the findings from 78 air samples and 102 surface samples
collected from the transit vehicles. Of the 78 air samples, 20 (25%) had detectable fentanyl
and 100% had detectable methamphetamine. Of the 102 surface samples, 47 (46%) had
detectable fentanyl and 100 (98%) had detectable methamphetamine. Detection of fentanyl
or methamphetamine by the lab does not mean it poses a health risk to operators or the
riding public.

Does anything seem...odd...about that paragraph?

this is your brain on drugs.

this is your brain on drugs.

Yep. They knew they were talking to Fox and were clearly lying.

LOL @ that clip.
------------------
I thought you'd enjoy it. :)

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