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Said on...NPR of all places.

https://www.npr.org/2024/04/29/1247741607/centrist...

MARTÍNEZ: Did you think that the way Donald Trump's administration used Title 42 was an effective way to stem immigration?

GLUESENKAMP PEREZ: I don't think it's a question of stemming immigration. I mean, immigration itself is not the problem. The problem is that the U.S. does not have operational control of the southern border, and so a lot of Americans, a lot of American politicians have had this real focus on the very visceral images of the humanitarian crisis of the southern border, but what they're not seeing is what it's like to live in a country that is being run by a cartel. And so Biden needs to exercise his existing authority under Remain in Mexico, and Congress needs to give him back the presidential expulsion authority under Title 42.

MARTÍNEZ: How do you try to talk to your caucus about that? Because those things sound very, very Republican.

Indeed they do.

On TMF I spent years saying - "punishment".

Give Liberals Liberalism....and they'll come begging.

Punishment - is indeed working precisely that way.

I still think it needs to be ratcheted up in ways that are, well, ugly.

I wish Sheeple were here. This was the crown jewel Punishment issue :)

LOL Dope being dishonest as always...

No where in the article does it say, "We need Trump border policy"

It says, "Congress needs to give him (Joe Biden) back the presidential expulsion authority under Title 42."

And, "The senate bill failed because of The Freedom Caucus. It was the right wing that required a two-thirds majority to pass. It would have had a bipartisan simple majority to pass. But, you know, as long as the extremes of the party control it, it does make it difficult."

Whether the article says, or doesn't say we need Trump border policy.....


BIDEN AND DEMOCRATS ARE SAYING IT LOL - and trying to spend billions on it.

But they failed at Trump CosPlay :)



I wonder if we can create a Tinder for illegals. "Swipe whatever, and get the nearest Yoga studio on a Blue City".....

Dope1: ...Congress needs to give him back the presidential expulsion authority under Title 42.

Umm, first, that authority belongs to the CDC Director and health officials, who, after determining there is a communicable disease in another country, must declare a public health emergency which would then require approval of the President in order to prohibit “the introduction of persons and property from such countries or places” for as long as health officials determine is necessary.

Bu there is no public health emergency.

Dope1: And so Biden needs to exercise his existing authority under Remain in Mexico...

Mexico's Ministry of Foreign Affairs said it rejected any effort to reimplement the "Migrant Protection Protocols" policy known as "remain in Mexico" for asylum-seekers.

"Regarding the possible implementation of this policy for the third time, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, on behalf of the Government of Mexico, expresses its rejection of the U.S. government's intention to return individuals processed under the program to Mexico."

And as we've repeatedly discussed, Trump killed the bipartisan immigration bill in order to have the border as a campaign issue.

Rather than take steps that would improve conditions at the southern border, republicans decided that chaos was better for Sleepy Don's reelection chances and, at Sleepy Don's insistence, refused to bring the bill to the floor for debate or for a vote. The bill would likely pass.

The current "humanitarian crisis of the southern border" is because of Trump and republicans.

Own it.

Bu there is no public health emergency.

Much like you can indict a ham sandwich, you can create an emergency if the need arises.

Mexico's Ministry of Foreign Affairs said it rejected any effort to reimplement the "Migrant Protection Protocols" policy known as "remain in Mexico" for asylum-seekers.

That's a negotiation with Mexico. A skilled negotiator could extract a deal. You people aren't skilled negotiators.

And as we've repeatedly discussed, Trump killed the bipartisan immigration bill in order to have the border as a campaign issue.

You seem to be under the impression that this bill was dissected here on this very board and found to be...wanting. That's a fancy way of saying, "it sucked".

Just because your side decided for once in the last 40 years you thought you'd move an inch on the subject doesn't make it some kind of "grand compromise".

Own it.

Own what? You people denied there was any problem at all for 3 years. Now that you're going to lose Congressional seats over this suddenly it's something to own.

Nah, bruv. The only thing owned here...is you.

Title 42 is not Trump policy. Title 42 is part of the Public Health Act. It dates back to 1944. It grants emergency powers to prevent the spread of diseases.

When the pandemic struck the CDC activated Title 42. When the pandemic subsided, the CDC had no valid reason UNDER TITLE 42 to continue enforcing the provision.

It's ironic that the same folks who laud an act that prevents the spread of disease, they were opposing the best measures science had to reduce the impact and spread of the disease (masking, vaccinating, maintaining safe distance).

Too bad Trump convinced his QOP minions to reject immigration legislation that would improve the migration situation.

The migration problems continue unabated due to Orange Jesus..

Umm, first, that authority belongs to the CDC Director and health officials,

Oh so true. It's always framed that Biden tried to terminate Title 42 - actually the CDC was considering termination and Congress and Biden asked them to extend it. They did. I'm not sure, but there were many programs assisting people and business through the pandemic that would cause hardship if cut off too early, and the bonus was the effect on the border. I've read Biden admin tried to replicate Title 42 and it didn't fly.


Mexico's Ministry of Foreign Affairs said it rejected any effort to reimplement the "Migrant Protection Protocols" policy known as "remain in Mexico" for asylum-seekers.

Very true. And - both the USA and China are investing in manufacturing, etc., in Mexico, we aren't the only game in town. We tried lifting the sanctions in Venezuela, but the government down there is not attempting a semblance of free elections so far - sanctions need to be reasserted. The former Mayor of Mexico City should be President soon and maybe we can find the right carrot to go with the stick.

The best chance we had for border legislation in ten to twenty years got flushed by Trump.

The best chance we had for border legislation in ten to twenty years got flushed by Trump. - lapsody

------------------

Odd choice of the word "we". As if you are trying to project how much your side craved border security, only to be disappointed in achieving your long sought after goal by Trump.

LOL. It’s like they’ve been given instructions to keep touting that trash bill as some kind of panacea.

And Trump was probably right. It's his only real issue. But MAGA believes he can do something without Congress. Which, of course, he can't. No POTUS can under current law without a health crisis (Title 42).

We went over all this in January, though MAGA will never accept the fact.

The CDC is the agency that declares a health crisis. It's up to them to establish the criteria. Title 42 deportations then follow.

https://www.newsweek.com/migrant-measles-cases-spa...

All one needs is the will to do something. It's clear that liberals do not possess the will.

All one needs is the will to do something.

...like lie about the $130,000 large you paid off a hooker, incite an insurrection, rape a woman in a dressing room....

Just ignore the laws, the constitution. Put in some judges to legislate from the bench.

Dope1:https://www.newsweek.com/migrant-measles-cases-spa...

All one needs is the will to do something.

Umm.

As of April 26, 2024, a total of 128 measles cases were reported by 20 jurisdictions: Arizona, California, Florida, Georgia, Illinois, Indiana, Louisiana, Maryland, Michigan, Minnesota, Missouri, New Jersey, New York City, New York State, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Vermont, Virginia, Washington, and West Virginia.

There have been 7 outbreaks (defined as 3 or more related cases) reported in 2024, and 67% of cases (86 of 128) are outbreak-associated. For comparison, 4 outbreaks were reported during 2023 and 48% of cases (28 of 58) were outbreak-associated.

Good luck in court making the case that measles is a public health emergency.

Republicans really are idiots.

https://www.cdc.gov/measles/cases-outbreaks.html

Republicans really are idiots.

Democrats support Hamas.

And Trump was probably right. It's his only real issue. But MAGA believes he can do something without Congress.

And when Trump fails at his many false promises, the MAGAs will accept his excuse that he was foiled by the far left, fascists, communists, anarchists....blah blah blah.

Me: Republicans really are idiots.

LurkerMom: Democrats support Hamas.

Thanks for illustrating my point.

commomone: Thanks for illustrating my point.

The truth hurts, doesn’t it?

Where is your democrat president?
Where is Chuck Schumer?
Where is Nancy Pelosi?
Where is Bernie Saunders?
Where is AOC and her Hamas loving cohorts?

Why are your democrats leaders not speaking out against Hamas and college riots?

Democrats love Hamas.

Wow! ChatNPC really told us, didn’t he?
Meanwhile, his terror encampment at UCLA is being cleaned out.

LurkerMom: Democrats love Hamas.

Here are the "no" votes in the Senate on the aid bill for Israel. I count two democrats and 15 republicans. Three republicans didn't vote: Paul, Scott, and Tuberville. All three have previously voiced a "no" position.

Barrasso	WY	R	No
Blackburn	TN	R	No
Braun	        IN	R	No
Budd	        NC	R	No
Cruz	        TX	R	No
Hagerty   	TN	R	No
Hawley	        MO	R	No
Johnson	        WI	R	No
Lee	        UT	R	No
Lummis	        WY	R	No
Marshall        KS	R	No
Merkley	        OR	D	No
Rubio	        FL	R	No
Sanders	        VT	I	No
Schmitt	        MO	R	No
Scott	        FL	R	No
Vance	        OH	R	No
Welch           VT	D	No

But please keep so eloquently illustrating my point that republicans are idiots.

Grovel all you want with nothing that has to do with the here and now Commomone.
But, in your favor your democrat president has finally been forced out of his hiding place, made a brief statement, then shuffled off back to his hiding hole refusing to take any questions.
Joe’s puppet handlers told him to get out of there and get out of there fast.

ChatNPC and the suck-up are having a bad week. Antifa, that they all claim doesn't exist and is merely an idea, is now rioting all over America and democrats are cheering it on. The Normies are getting a good look at what and who the democrats are.

Give it t-minus 1 hour and the bots here will have a post up about how all the pro-Hamas rioters are all funded by Qatar and There's Nothing To See Here.

Give it t-minus 1 hour and the bots here will have a post up about how all the pro-Hamas rioters are all funded by Qatar and There's Nothing To See Here.

And yet, still not denying their Hamas support.

Good luck in court making the case that measles is a public health emergency.

Republicans really are idiots.

The MAGAantivax/anti-POC immigrant people and science denying libs together are responsible for the measles outbreaks.

The solution is so simple, even most MAGAs know that vaccine is overwhelmingly beneficial and could resolve the miniscule measles issue immediately.

By the logic of 'those people' we should deport 'those MAGA & antivax people.'

And yet, still not denying their Hamas support.

Nope. It's been amusing to watch them build their little walls and get their Black Bloc on just like what happened with the BLM riots. It's the same exact left wing riot playbook.

What'll be interesting is that during the Trump Presidency Antifa's antics were something that the democrats could point to as evidence of a racist Trump administration. Now that it's making them look bad, let's see if the DOJ finally gets serious about them.

For the argument about there not being serious crimes here, don't overlook the fact that many of these clowns traffic their rioting across state lines.

Me: Republicans really are idiots.

LurkerMom: Democrats support Hamas.

Thanks for illustrating my point.

I'm socially lib, financially conservative.

Most of the people with whom we socialize are liberal (coastal elite). Some oppose the magnitude of what appears to be indiscriminate Israeli bombing.

A friend yesterday expressed the belief that the IDF has enough special forces to wage a successful ground fight against Hamas militants. He does not support Hamas.

His belief may result from a misunderstanding of Iran's intentions. It's clear that Israel is up against against Iranian proxies. Iran's goal is elimination of Israel, control of the Middle East by an Islamic council.

By sheer numbers, Israel cannot win a ground war; a war of attrition. Until Iran concedes and gets onboard with a 2 state solution, Israel must defend its sovereignty militarily.

Now that it's making them look bad, let's see if the DOJ finally gets serious about them.

For the argument about there not being serious crimes here, don't overlook the fact that many of these clowns traffic their rioting across state lines.

As noted above, there's not really much to suggest that there are federal crimes being committed. Crimes don't become federal just because people are crossing state lines - you have to cross the state line as part of the crime for it to be a federal case. That's why "classic" crossing state line cases (kidnapping or carrying drugs across state lines) are federal cases - you're kidnapping or possessing the drugs the entire time.

There's no real reason to think that's happened here. A huge chunk of the people involved are students and faculty of the institutions - most of the rest are just going to be local folks. That's because these things are so widespread and happening simultaneously - there's no need for someone in Oregon to drive down to California, because there's certainly a college protest in their neighborhood already.

But mostly because the crimes being committed don't lend themselves to gaining federal jurisdiction. Trespass and property damage aren't things that you can do across a state line. Crossing a state line to join a protest and then committing trespass and property damage doesn't make it federal, either. If you can bring a conspiracy charge, that could possibly stand up a federal investigation - but that's really unlikely, given the nature of what's happened.

Finally, there's no evidence that Hamas in any way supported these incidents. It's incredibly unlikely - they rather have their hands full right now, and probably can't provide any kind of support to activities in Gaza City, let alone New York City.

So there's not really any reason for DOJ to be involved. January 6 took place in DC (a federal enclave), and nearly all the crimes were committed in the Capitol building (a federal facility). So all the cases had at least one federal component. That's really, really unlikely to be the case here.

As noted above, there's not really much to suggest that there are federal crimes being committed. Crimes don't become federal just because people are crossing state lines - you have to cross the state line as part of the crime for it to be a federal case. That's why "classic" crossing state line cases (kidnapping or carrying drugs across state lines) are federal cases - you're kidnapping or possessing the drugs the entire time.

The Antfia people ship supplies across state lines and have support networks that go from state to state, all with the intent of committing crimes.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2101

18 U.S. Code § 2101 - Riots
U.S. Code

(a)Whoever travels in interstate or foreign commerce or uses any facility of interstate or foreign commerce, including, but not limited to, the mail, telegraph, telephone, radio, or television, with intent—
(1)to incite a riot; or
(2)to organize, promote, encourage, participate in, or carry on a riot; or
(3)to commit any act of violence in furtherance of a riot; or
(4)to aid or abet any person in inciting or participating in or carrying on a riot or committing any act of violence in furtherance of a riot;
and who either during the course of any such travel or use or thereafter performs or attempts to perform any other overt act for any purpose specified in subparagraph (A), (B), (C), or (D) of this paragraph— [1]
Shall be fined under this title, or imprisoned not more than five years, or both.

Antifa and what they do fit the very definition of this law. Whether the DOJ chooses to pursue it is another matter (I suspect they won't, but they could if so motivated).

But please keep so eloquently illustrating my point that republicans are idiots.

That's harsh but... You have to be willfully ignorant to support Trump.

The Antfia people ship supplies across state lines and have support networks that go from state to state, all with the intent of committing crimes.

That wouldn't give the feds jurisdiction over the case absent a specific federal crime. Again, the crime has to cross the state lines. Not the supplies.

You quoted the riot statute, which does create a specific federal crime. But it's a very hard one to prove. You have to prove more than just people shipping supplies for protests, even protests that are likely to result in a riot. You have to show that they specifically intended that the supplies be used in a riot. Which is very, very hard to do. And that statute wouldn't be applicable here, since none of these campus incidents have been "riots" as that term is used in the criminal code.

Antifa and what they do fit the very definition of this law.

Again, no. A national group supporting local groups with supplies (or organization) doesn't satisfy that law. Even if the local group were to go out and commit a riot with those supplies. The individuals in the national group need to be proven to have: i) intended that the supplies be used in a riot (not just to help the group in any other way); and ii) have themselves personally taken an overt act themselves in furtherance of the riot. That first one is going to be almost impossible to prove, and the second is exceptionally unlikely to exist in the current situation.

The CDC is the agency that declares a health crisis. It's up to them to establish the criteria. Title 42 deportations then follow.

All one needs is the will to do something. It's clear that liberals do not possess the will.

This reminds me of a character in a Dean Koontz novel that thought as he did things he was 'becoming' and that as he did more he would become invincible and eventually be unstoppable - by the sheer will of becoming.

Well, Dope, the sheer will of becoming was demonstrated on Jan 6. Yes, we saw the will of Trump and Jan 6ers overcome the electoral college, reinstall Trump as President and save 'Murica. We are in awe of the absolute power of sheer will.

On the other hand the character in the novel is killed because he thinks he has become bulletproof. But Jan 6 shows us all the power of sheer will.

"The Antfia people ship supplies across state lines and have support networks that go from state to state,"

This is utter nonsense. Demonstrations on college campuses are completely spontaneous as young students react to the violent injustice inflicted on Palestinian women and children. They bear witness to the destruction of a functioning society.

Hospitals destroyed on the thinnest pretext.
Doctors killed.
University and Medical School destroyed.
Critical infrastructure gone.
75% of housing flattened.
Food and water withheld.

The "intent" may have been to eliminate Hamas but the result has been to push Gaza into the stone age.

This is utter nonsense. Demonstrations on college campuses are completely spontaneous as young students


LOLOL. You really do believe this, don’t you?

Late to reply. I'll try to look at the reply section every day.

BHM: Odd choice of the word "we". As if you are trying to project how much your side craved border security, only to be disappointed in achieving your long sought after goal by Trump.

"We" are a nation, unless you have other ideas. I told you my grand plan - to use "embassy" like powers and create complete processing systems in Mexico, so only those deemed true refugees come across the border. But we have a different problem(s) that were never discussed.

Gangs are operating the system that brings the wannabees up from Ecuador. This is a "for profit" operation. We need to deal with that because they advertise on social media. It costs around 20k to get to the border from China - and a lot of the Chinese do qualify now. Only recently could we ship the unqualified back to China.

The other problem is there are just too many people in the world that will qualify, and the other part is - how do we verify all of them? After reading we seem to do a good job of verifying, but I'm still mystified we do that good of a job. Out of 8 billion people probably 330 million people qualify. We can't take them all.

So to me there are only "sides" when politics enters in. I recognize a problem, want it dealt with, was hopeful when the plan came out, just as shocked as you at how it worked, but I reacted differently. The world doesn't have to adjust to me, I have to adjust to the world. So I adjusted to the fact we could only shut down the border part of the time, and hoped we could find further solutions or quotas, etc., down the road.

One of my oddball ideas was we let Mexico run an annual lottery, and we give an open complete path to citizenship to 100 Mexicans - or we could give the path to a thousand and make it the entire Latin America. Funds from the lottery would help social programs in Mexico or Latin America, and a portion to reduce border costs for the USA- Mexican border for both countries. Normal prohibitions would apply. YMMV.

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