Subject: Re: War, currencies and jurisdictions
And it doesn't really matter what NATO thinks about it, what matters is what Russia thinks.

Sure, I have no problem with that view. The Russian government has a bit of a paranoia that isn't exactly new, so sure, they see it that way to some extent: they expect everybody in the world wants to invade them at any time. They probably see an Apple store within 1000km of their borders as a threat.

What bugs me is odious apologists in the West who spout the same line, that it's the west's fault for doing something about not wanting to be invaded: banding together.


Looking at a map, can anybody explain how Turkey is North Atlantic?

Per my comment, so I wouldn't agree at all that it's a problem. NATO is just an acronym (I forget what language) for "Don't want Russia to invade here". I can see the Turks getting behind that notion. Or Georgians, for that matter.

Everybody with more than a room temperature IQ knows that NATO was purposely moving toward Russia.

Nope. Again, it's not "NATO moving towards Russia", it's "More countries worried about Russia attacking them". The same result in terms of the boundaries of the treaty countries, but the latter makes it clear that it is entirely rational behaviour on the part of those joining NATO, and not in any way a "move" towards Russia.. NATO wasn't about to invade Russia. The Kremlin sees neighbours putting up better fences as a threat, but that's in their heads.

What's the option? Behave more passively and don't build an army just so Russia will feel less emotionally aggrieved when they cross your borders in tanks? Personally I don't think their hurt feelings are that important, and it certainly doesn't affect their actions. Every dictator and would-be dictator becomes a territorial expansionist when control looks like it might slip. Nothing like jingoism to get the masses in line behind you, or at least enough of them to consolidate your grip. And as a result there is nothing so tempting to such a person as a nearby smaller and isolated country. I can understand such a country not wishing to be isolated any longer than necessary.

So much, so obvious. The *interesting* question is whether the European NATO countries will respond when Canada has to invoke article 5 when the Americans invade for a third time, expecting erroneously for the third time that the population will rise up in support of the move.

Jim